welsh kilts

[dave martin]

is this a tommy cooper put on that was taken for a ride by authentic welsh shops in kerdiff , ?

[Ceri Shaw]

For once the Wikipedia gets it more or less right:-

"A Welsh Kilt (Welsh: Cilt) is a type of kilt worn in Wales and by Welshmen. Although not considered a traditional component of Welsh national dress, the kilt has become recently popular in the Celtic nations as a sign of Celtic identity.[6] Kilts and tartans can therefore also be seen in Cornwall, the Isle of Man, the Tras-os-Montes region in the North of Portugal, and Galicia in Spain, as well as England, particularly the North East. Nowadays with Welsh nationalism on the rise and a resurgence of Welsh national pride, kilts (or cilts in Welsh) are being worn more and more by Welshmen.[7]

The St David's Tartan or brithwe Dewi Sant is one of the most popular tartans in Wales, but individual family tartans are being produced, despite there being no evidence that the Welsh (or any other Celtic nation for that matter) traditionally used tartan to identify families. Williams, Jones, Thomas, Evans, and Davies are among the most popular tartans and common names in Wales. The Welsh National tartan was designed by D.M. Richards in 1967 to demonstrate Wales' connection with the greater Celtic world. Its colours (green, red, and white) are the colours of the Welsh national flag.

Although they are generally seen these days in formal settings like weddings, there has been an increase in the number of people wearing their kilt to a rugby or football match, paired with a jersey rather than a formal jacket."

[Ceri Shaw]

So when are we going to see the Martin Tartan Dave? The girlfriend is knitting ours as we speak.....lol.

[dave martin]

excuse me i went to asdas web site via wiki what? polish center of ethnic kulture , its notes are some what missleading it states that a welsh group of middleclass twits reinvented welsh kulture during the mid sixties to suport a bunch of peole with suspect welsh names with a living after their arts grants were lost

[Joel Thomas Fabin]

I think Welsh kilts are still gaining some provenance. Kilts are for sure not traditionally Welsh. For some reason the Scots seem to poke at other celtic countries who would like to adopt wearing them. I have seen some pretty heated arguments bewteen Irish and Scottish, in regards to who actually had tartan and kilts first.

Personally, I don't think anyone will truly know where and when they originated. Many Scottish tartans were romantic creations by the Sobieskis, of the Tudors. Queen Victoria had designs on what she percieved, or at least wanted to believe Celtic culture was. Those that wanted a Celtic cultural revival, bit hook line and sinker this romantic version of what it was to be a Celt.

Anyway, today I do wear a kilt. Infact, it is required that pipers compete in "proper highland attire". I enjoy wearing the kilt, and I don't think it matters if it is a Scottish tartan, or a newly created Welsh tartan. I do believe however, that if you choose to wear a kilt, that it be worn in the prescribed traditional fashion that is in place nowadays. Believe it or not...'highland attire' is a bit of a science.

On a last note I would like to see the Welsh tartans registered so as to add some ligitimancy. Please excuse my spelling!

Joel

[gaabi]

I like kilts on men but I DON'T like the idea of Welsh tartan - it seems too fake and Disneyland-ish to me and too much like desperately copying Scotland to get some attention or something. Let's find out what our own things are and do those. I think if you have to wear a kilt to be a piper and you want it to be Welsh, how about Draig Goch or plain leather kilts?

Vin Diesel in awesome black kilt from 21st Century Kilts
http://www.21stcenturykilts.com/celebrityclients.htm#

www.kiltednation.com

[Joel Thomas Fabin]

Leather kilts? Definitely not! As I said, I think if the Welsh kilt were recognized by the tartan society in Scotland, and properly recorded, then I don't see any issue with this. I wear either a band tartan or one of the tartans from my Scottish ancestry or close affiliation. For example, I wear the Henderson tartan. Jim Henderson was my first bagpipe teacher from Aberdeen Scotland, he was also like a father to me during my teen years. When he passed away he left me his pipes and his kilt. If I ever have children I will probably insist they wear a Henderson tartan, as it is a tradition that if a host asks you wear their tartan, you honor them in doing so. I have recently found more Scots ancestry along a maternal line in my family...Glenn, Gordon, and Wilkinson, However, it is not traditional to wear tartan along maternal lines.

My original surname is Jones, which in my opinion is a very handsome Welsh tartan...alas it is commercially contrived. However, all hope is not lost, it could someday have its own provenance. Us celtic peoples have been sharing culture for centuries upon centuries.I think if we as Welsh folk decide to partake in this cultural aspect from our Scottish cousins, then we should. But we should also go about it in a correct manner. I believe we shouldn't seperate ourselves from our other cousins too much.

And as I've said, I haven't really seen too much solid evidence of what culture really started tartan, and kilt. Of course the Scots (which I am too) want it to be exclusive to them, but I wouldn't say that is absolute. I will give two more examples: Don't forget that at one time Welsh peoples were found as far north as modern day Edinburgh, the Scottish clan Wallace, has Welsh roots. And lastly, tartan was supposedly only found in the Highlands and Highland clans MacDonald, MacLeod, MacDougall etc... Why is it then, that now, 'lowland' Scots wear totaly accepted tartans?

As you can see, lot's of gray areas in regards to tartan.

Cheers,

Joel

[gaabi]

I love the story of your wearing the Henderson tartan and I think that would be a honor to wear and for your children to wear. :) I'm also some Scottish, MacTamhais, and looking for that tartan to make kilts for my boys (it's frikking expensive!).

Are leather kilts uncomfortable? I remember the guy who did the blacksmith demonstration at the Anne Arundel games wore a black leather kilt with a belt for his tools and a little nail and tool bag instead of a sporran and he looked fantastic! (he just looked fantastic anyway, but that only helped)

And you're right, there are definitely grey areas in anything, and in the US we figure it out for ourselves - ;)

[Mike Brooks of Here Be Dragons]

I have a Draig Goch Cilt and once someone came up to say he didn't approve (His wife liked it though) but I've lost count of the number of people who make favourable comments. In fact I could have sold at least half a dozen if the person who made mine wanted to make more.

Obviously it's not the sort of thing to wear at a formal occasion but it's fun, and being proud of being Welsh doesn't mean you have to take yourself too seriously.

I wear my cilt way more than I wear a tie.

[ArthMawr]

Kilt wearing was introduced to Britain by the Romans - The old school, one piece pleated plaid belted at the waist. But the complex and traditional TARTANS are distinctly and historically Scottish. The modern dress Kilt as originated in the Victorian era is most peoples idea of a kilt but it dates back much further. As for arguments between Irish and Scottish over precedent - since the Scots came to Britain from Ireland perhaps they discovered and adopted it from the Welsh Britons already there, who in turn had acquired the fashion from the romans.
The Welsh tartans will never be on a par with the lineage of the Scots clans but should definitely be registered.
Its all a lovely Celtic Confabulation and nothing gets the ladies more excited than the hairy leg, nobbly knees, man in a skirt with a hairy pouch combination.

Kilt up and rock on!

[gaabi]

ROFL! Yes,as a chick, I have to say that men in kilts are, indeed, way HOT!

[Dafydd Owain Hughes]

Personally I quite like the Welsh tartan; it's a good way for Americans to start relating Welsh people to Celtic culture rather than Anglo-Saxon. To be fair historically speaking the Scots only started wearing kilts a relatively short time ago, before that they wore plaid trousers (circa William Wallace) like the other celts. Personally I like telling people that my scarf is Hughes' tartan and is relevant to my ethnicity and culture, let's face it the Irish and Scots have had plenty of identifying features in the US over the years, why not us? It's not like I can wear a Welsh rugby shirt to work every day, and dress my little girl in a stove pipe hat and apron..

[dave martin]

so wearing of welsh tartan in kilts is ok now this brings me to the second part of my question is it ok for taffs to go breezing while wearing the kilt or is it a scots thing only ?